Podcast Fascinating women: Sam Shackleton
(word-for-word transcipt is at the end)

Audio from the Fascinating Women podcast features host Mark Lore interviewing Sam Shackleton, a versatile artist and the founder of Shackleton Design. The discussion navigates through her adventurous past, the complexities of modern parenting, and her profound journey of self-discovery following a difficult divorce.

An Adventurous Spirit and Modern Parenting

Sam’s early life was marked by a bold, independent streak, most notably an open-ended trip to Thailand and Australia at age 18. Reflecting on this time, she notes that while the world was as dangerous then as it is now, the lack of constant digital information made it feel safer. Now a mother of two children (ages 8 and 11), she prioritizes teaching them adaptability and self-belief, especially as the rise of AI makes traditional career paths unpredictable.

The Creative Journey: From Art to Design

Sam has identified as an artist since childhood, though she was initially discouraged from pursuing it professionally by her father. She eventually found a balance in graphic and web design—a field she views as a "structured art form".

• Design Philosophy: She distinguishes between her corporate work, which is refined and simple, and her personal art, which she describes as "boho, hippie, and spiritual".
• Handling Rejection: Early in her career, she struggled with client rejection, but she eventually learned to view it objectively as a tool for refinement rather than a personal failure.
• The "Easy" Trap: She discusses the creative struggle of valuing one’s work, noting that artists often find it difficult to charge appropriately for skills that come to them naturally.

Resilience Through Personal Turmoil

A significant portion of the interview focuses on Sam’s 12-year marriage, which she describes as having been abusive. She attributes her long stay in the relationship to being young and impressionable, often valuing others' opinions over her own intuition.

• The Recovery Process: Healing required a deliberate choice to become self-aware and to grieve not just the relationship, but the version of herself she lost.
• Rejecting the "Victim" Label: Sam resonates with the trend of women moving from "victim" to "survivor," though she cautions against skipping the necessary grieving process in a rush to appear strong.

Core Philosophies and Lessons

Sam shares the guiding principles that now anchor her life:

• Power of Intention and Gratitude: She believes thoughts create reality and uses intentional gratitude to shift her energy, especially during difficult times.
• Thinking for Oneself: A lesson from her atheist father, she believes in respecting others' opinions while always maintaining an independent perspective.
• Embracing Chaos: Despite a natural tendency toward anxiety and a need for control, Sam finds she is often at her best when forced to "go with the flow" in unpredictable situations.

"It's easy to be the best version of yourself when everything is going well... you get to know people over time when you see how they react to things." — Sam Shackleton

How do Sam's views on the "structured art" of design compare to your own understanding of the balance between creativity and professional constraints?

I apologize for the oversight regarding the spelling of your name. Here is the corrected word-for-word transcript of the interview with Mark Laurie.

The Word-for-Word Transcript

Part 1: Early Adventures and Perspective on Safety

Mark Laurie: Hello everyone and welcome back to Fascinating Women. I'm so glad you're here to listen to our newest guest, who is Sam. Sam has a very pleasant energy. Some people have energy that's over the top, and Sam is this really neat, soft-personality kind of character that's still kind of driven. Welcome to the show, Sam.

Sam Shackleton: Thanks. Appreciate it.

Mark Laurie: What is the most exciting thing you've done in your life?

Sam Shackleton: Most exciting thing I've done in my life? Well, I mean, I have two kids. Of course, you know, they are the most exciting thing I've ever done because I never thought I would have kids, honestly. I was always one of those people that was like, "No, absolutely not". Um, starting my own business, traveling... there've been a few things.

Mark Laurie: Where'd you like to travel to?

Sam Shackleton: Uh, everywhere, honestly. I went to Thailand and Australia when I was 18.

Mark Laurie: Wow.

Sam Shackleton: It was probably one of the most exciting things I did, just up and took off on an open-ended trip with two cousins of mine and a bit of cash and got a work visa and said, "Mom and Dad, I don't know when I'm coming back".

Mark Laurie: How'd that feel?

Sam Shackleton: It felt—at 18, I mean, yeah, you're like at that age where you just kind of want to get out of the house.

Mark Laurie: Sounds like five, six years ago?

Sam Shackleton: It feels like it, honestly. Wow, 20 years ago. I'm 38, so that was 20 years ago. And uh, it was an adventure, I'll say that.

Mark Laurie: Is that the kind of thing a person could do today? I mean, the world's a much different place. Could a person do that safely today?

Sam Shackleton: I would be—if my kids turned 18 and wanted to go traveling, I'd be terrified, honestly.

Mark Laurie: Were your parents terrified for you?

Sam Shackleton: Oh yeah. Oh yeah. My dad, my dad was like, "Go, you'll be fine". My mom was just in tears. And back then, there was just internet cafes. There was no cell phones and like, "Hey Mom and Dad," they would hear back from me once a week.

Mark Laurie: We had—when I was a kid we'd do a thing where we'd phone collect for someone else, they'd say "No," you hang up, so you have that a minute or something before the charges would start kicking in. That way they'd know I'm alive, so that was the "I'm alive" hit kind of thing. Or we'd say, "Tom's house, wrong number," and they'd hang up, they knew where I was at.

Sam Shackleton: I know, I know. But yeah, to answer your question, I think there's—it's safer in some respects, but there's also so much going on in the earth. And I mean, there's different ways to keep in touch and be safe and know what your kids are up to.

Mark Laurie: I think the thing that could be different though—my suspicion is—that the world 20 years ago was just as dangerous as it is now. But we did not know that because there's no flood of story. So we had no idea how dangerous it was.

Sam Shackleton: Sure. Yes. We almost have too much knowledge right now and it's—it drives us crazy and... yeah.

Part 2: Parenting and Career Adaptability

Mark Laurie: How old are your kids?

Sam Shackleton: My kids are 8 and 11.

Mark Laurie: Does your world revolve around them?

Sam Shackleton: Oh, yes. I mean, as a parent, it always does. You try to make time for yourself and your business and your kids, but I mean, they're always the ultimate goal, you know what I mean? Making sure they're taken care of and happy.

Mark Laurie: Where do you draw resources from to like after your kids? To shape them? I don't mean look after them, but to shape them. Where do you draw that from?

Sam Shackleton: People around me, um, you know, people who inspire me, people that I look up to, trying to pass on that knowledge to them. Um, trying to make sure I'm taken care of so that I have the resources and I have the energy to show up for them.

Mark Laurie: Well, yeah. If you're not looked after, if you're a wreck, then that's bad role modeling for one. What's the core thing you want to shape them into? Like, what's the...

Sam Shackleton: Ah, just to—well, as a parent, you're trying to not pass on all the things, all the lessons that you had to learn. Right. So for me, it's just being confident, believing in themselves, understanding that they can have whatever they want. Especially going into this age of AI and the world is changing and we have no idea... I don't even know what to recommend for a career for them right now because everything is just changing. So just to, you know, believe in themselves.

Mark Laurie: I don't think you can recommend a career. I remember 30 years ago for me, it was pointed out that the generational thing had happened. And he said 75% of all the jobs that—back in those days if you were a farmer or a mechanic, you sort of fell in your parents' footsteps—75% of the jobs that your parents had won't exist.

Sam Shackleton: You were told this?

Mark Laurie: Yeah, back 30 years ago. Okay. And so now it's just—you want to have, and what I was told back then was, you want to have a tool to learn, so that you're adaptable. You want to be adaptable.

Sam Shackleton: Being adaptable. That's a good one. That was the—that was my core lesson. I'll pass that on to you.

Part 3: Balancing Life and Finding Inspiration

Mark Laurie: How do you do balance? Like, you've got your kids, you've got your life, you've got your relationship, and you've got yourself. Do you have a formula for balancing?

Sam Shackleton: Phew, I don't have a formula, but I am always constantly figuring it out and it is a balance. And it's learning how to be intentional about it. Because if I don't intentionally figure out how to balance all of that, intentionally take time for myself, I just get overwhelmed or I get consumed with one thing and then, you know, things get messy. So it's a matter of, yeah, making sure I prioritize time with my partner—those date nights, time for us. Time for our kids, because I've got two kids, he's got two kids, so sometimes there's four kids in the house! And trying to make time for them and then our hobbies, too. I'm a martial artist, so making time for that. It's just really intentionally sometimes scheduling it in and... but then also being flexible with it too and trying not to be too rigid.

Mark Laurie: You said you've got some people that inspire you. Who are they and why?

Sam Shackleton: You know, the people that inspire me most are people that are closest to me. A couple of really good girlfriends in my Capoeira group who have been through a lot of hard things in their lives and just keep showing up. And they're in these leadership roles and they keep showing up no matter what's happening in their lives and that inspires me to keep showing up, too. A couple of good girlfriends I have, the same thing. Like if we're going through something in our lives, we show up for each other. I don't find for me it's necessarily like celebrities or big figures, it's more like the people that are closest to me. Quite often female figures, actually.

Mark Laurie: The concept of date night. That always seems to make it so formal. Like we view dating as this whole romantic, spontaneous thing. Did that—is that something that evolved, or is it a phrase you use, or is it something that's intentionally happened?

Sam Shackleton: "Date night"? That phrase? I don't know, you know, it's just a phrase that I think our generation kind of uses. It's just making time for that night where, you know, you're in a relationship for a long time and you just—you sometimes forget to actually still date each other. Right. But you should be. You should be long-term, you know, making time for that and going on those dates, not just like hanging out or doing your usual thing.

Mark Laurie: "Let's go for dinner". "Okay, dinner".

Sam Shackleton: Yeah! We try to take turns planning them. Um, you know, it can be going out to dinner, it can be a concert, it can be a weekend away. It's less about what it is and more about just taking that time and planning something for each other that we know we're going to enjoy, that gets us out of the head-space that we're in, takes us away from work and the responsibilities. Because we're both very entrepreneurial and busy.

Part 4: Professional Design and Personal Healing

Mark Laurie: Entrepreneur. Have you always been an entrepreneur?

Sam Shackleton: You know, I feel like I've always sort of been that way. I haven't necessarily always been in an entrepreneurial role; I've had traditional jobs, I've had so many different jobs. But I've always sort of done something creative on the side, I've always had a little side gig or like creative vision or been working on something. So I think I've always been that way, just never full-time.

Mark Laurie: How young were you when that started?

Sam Shackleton: The first I remember was like a thing we did in school. I can't remember what grade it was. It was actually where we had to start a little mini-business. And they gave us, I think, $1,500 bucks or something, and me and a classmate, we had to go and start a little business. We started a candle business. Went, bought the supplies, showed up at trade shows and, you know, learning profit and loss and all that. So it was interesting. I'm sure it went way back before then, like just making drawings and selling them. Or we used to, as little kids—I used to live in this tiny, tiny little town, no one would ever buy anything—but we'd be out there like making crafts and getting out there and trying to sell them.

Mark Laurie: So rejection came early.

Sam Shackleton: Yep! Sitting out there for hours and there's no cars driving by, but we tried, we tried our best.

Mark Laurie: How do you deal with rejection? Like, as an entrepreneur you get a lot of it.

Sam Shackleton: It was a struggle early on in my career. But being a graphic and web designer and a creative person, I mean, in college we were told like, "You have to get used to it". Create something—because what I do, a lot of what I do is to me creating art. If I'm creating a logo or a website or a poster or whatever it is, to me it's like a piece of art and it can be very personal. And a lot of designers will attest to this: that when a client rejects or says, "I hate this," the first few times you hear that you're just crushed because your "baby" was rejected. But you get used to that and you understand that you get better with it. You almost start to expect it. And it just doesn't hurt anymore because you remove—it's nothing personal. It's usually more about them and instead of taking it personally and feeling hurt, you just ask more questions.

Mark Laurie: How'd you get through that hard section of your life?

Sam Shackleton: Um, it was having some of those friends like I mentioned. I went through a divorce six years ago and I experienced some abuse in that divorce, in that—and it was 12 years of that. And it was brutal. And it took those friendships and people asking me questions and a friend who was essentially going through the same thing as me at the same time for us to ask each other questions to get us to see our intuition and see the truth of what was happening and believe in ourselves and open up the doors for that self-awareness and self-reflection to see, "Oh, this is what's happening and now what do I do with that"?

Mark Laurie: 12 years. That's a long time to not notice you're being abused. How does that happen?

Sam Shackleton: I was very young. I was very young and again, I was in that space where I didn't really trust myself and I put more power—I gave more power to what other people would tell me about myself as opposed to what I actually knew about myself. And being young, 19 years old, really impressionable... I see how I played into it and I see how I got myself into that situation and how it unfolded over 12 years.

Mark Laurie: Thank you for your time with us today. It's been interesting. I'm glad you shared so deeply, I appreciate that. Everyone, this is Sam.